Episode 21
Gary Box – Episode 021 – A Photographer Podcast Interview
This is an episode you do not want to miss. Gary Box is on the podcast today. Kia has known Gary since the first conference she attended. Gary is starting his 30th year of being a full time professional photographer. Matt says Gary’s Facebook group (link?) is the best photographer FB group. Gary thinks basic lighting fundamentals is missing from the education world. Gary is excited about the new technology like hi speed sync. Listen in to hear how Gary got into photography. Hear what Gary suggests you do and do not spend your $1000 on. Make sure you pay close attention to the best advice Gary received. Gary’s personal habits that lead to his success include being a recovering workaholic. He works hard and is hard on his work.
Recommendations:
Texas School PPA- https://www.texasschool.org/
Godox lighting
FB group link: https://www.facebook.com/groups/insidetheboxphotogroup/
Inside the box hacks (Kia recommended)
Books – Audible
The Storybrand by Donald Miller (https://amzn.to/2RUcYTW)
Seth Godin (https://amzn.to/2TlElmy)
Transcription was done by Temi.com which means it’s an AI generated transcript. The transcript may contain spelling, grammar and other errors, and is not a substitute for watching the video.
Gary: [00:01] This is Gary box and you are listening to from nothing to profit.
Speaker 2: [00:05] Welcome to from nothing to profit, a photographer’s podcast with Matt and Kayak where each week they talk to photographers about what is working in their business now so you can swipe those ideas and grow your business faster.
Kia: [00:21] Hello everyone. We are so excited to have our friend Gary box here today on the podcast. And I have to tell you that I have known Gary probably from actually the very first photography conference I attended. Gary was there. I brought pictures of a high school senior doing ballet or dance or something in a CPA background. And we talked about it. He was speaking at it and for some reason, Gary, you wore, you had some teeth, like some, some, uh, like main mangy nasty teeth that you put on as a joke. Billy Billy Bob Teeth. Yeah. And so, uh, so I have known, yeah, over 20 years. And Gary, you have been such an amazing influence to the photography industry as a whole. And then just, you know, seeing what you do as a photographer over the years with high school, senior photography and then sharing and how much you shared. So I’m super excited to have you on here today because I think you’re a great example of creating profit in the photography industry over all kinds of changes. And so I think you have a lot to add to us today.
Gary: [01:35] Thank you, Kai. I’m really glad to be here. I have been in the industry for quite a while. I’m starting my 30th year professional full time and you know, I’ve run the gamut of things. I’ve gone from high volume. We were doing 1100 sessions a year at one point with nine employees to medium volume and mid priced and you know, now I’m doing a lower volume and a higher price. So I’ve Kinda got a little bit of a experience with, with all three business models.
Matt: [02:03] That’s awesome. So here’s Gary, here’s how I know you. So years and years ago I was in the pro form and you were really active in that. And uh, I didn’t really know you at the time and I, it’s interesting, we’ve gone circles wrench on them, we don’t really know each other that well even today. And then I kinda lost track of you and then about a year ago someone was like, you need to be in Gary Boxes, facebook group. And I was like, okay. So I just was like, request and you approve me. And it is like the best I. and I’ve said this before, not when you were here, I said this on a previous podcast. It is the best facebook group for photographers by far.
Gary: [02:37] Well thank you. I’ve put a lot of time into it and you know, one of the things that I’ve tried to do is keep out some of the negativity and, and bad attitudes so that, you know, the creatives can, can thrive in that environment. And I try to mix a both business and artistic elements, both of them into that group.
Matt: [02:59] That’s awesome. Um, okay. So yeah, so I don’t. So tell me where you’re located because I don’t even know where your studio is.
Gary: [03:03] Okay. My studio is right on route 66 highway in Sapulpa, Oklahoma. That’s just a little ways outside of Tulsa, kind of. I’m really a blue collar town. Most of my business comes in from other areas and uh, it’s just a great place to be. We have really low cost of living and great friendly people here.
Matt: [03:23] Awesome. Awesome. Okay, so I’m going to jump into the first question and because you kind of already talked about your expertise and I mean I think 30 years speaks for itself, so we’ll just jump into kind of what you think is working now. So you know, tell us a story of what you think is working in your business or what you think is working in the industry right now.
Gary: [03:40] Well, one of the things that I’ve always stood by is there has been a lot of change in our industry and I’ve watched, and I’ve gone through it. I was one of the early pioneers in the digital world and helped a lot of people make that transition. As the digital world has come down in cost, obviously the market has become flooded and there’s been so many people out there teaching and so much, but one of the things that I see is something that’s lacking now in today’s teaching or just core fundamentals, you know, just basic lighting fundamentals and honestly that’s, that’s how I have, how I’ve done my photography for years. I try to be current and up to date, but I still try to hold those fundamental things, you know, close to me like, you know, simply where does the light go and you know, good exposure and things like that. And I think that’s something that’s really missing in our industry right now is people teaching good, wholesome fundamentals. They all want to know the cool stuff, but not something as basic as where does the light go?
Matt: [04:43] Well, and sometimes I think they want to fix some funding with a pre for the pre-sentence. They’re just lighting it correctly at the beginning, you know?
Kia: [04:49] Exactly. Yeah. I’ve been seeing some APP just like editors on instagram and they’re just absolutely beautiful images, but what they start with could have been so much better if they just would have done the work in camera. It’s crazy. Yeah. And you definitely can teach lighting. I saw on your facebook group the other day, your video of your, uh, all your equipment, your equipment, a hallway with all of it. I don’t know how many you, you’d like tripods and nightstands, you had. And I was like, oh my goodness. Gary knows this stuff. Definitely.
Gary: [05:24] Well, you know, I have a large studio. It’s about 6,000 square feet. I’ve got several shooting areas and, and I liked to work real efficiently, so I just keep equipment setup and all these different areas.
Kia: [05:34] Yeah. That’s so fun. Yeah. People should definitely go to your facebook group and watch some of the videos of your ad laced, the latest ones where you’re hacks a inside the box hacks. And I thought that was really fun to see. So yeah. Yeah, it looked like it. So, uh, what is the one thing that you are most fired up about? In our industry, like whether you’re excited about it, whether you’re about it, just,
Gary: [05:58] you know, what, what are you thinking about these days? Well, for me personally, one of the thing that really excites me is as I’ve slowed down in volume, I am finding more time to be creative and to uh, you know, to flex my creative wings and do stuff that’s different and no pun intended out of the box and I’m really, really enjoying that. For years I was just so focused on making money, making money and I, and I did that well, but I didn’t really get to enjoy what I do well enough. So that’s more my personal view than industry wide, industry wide. I mean we continue to see technology changes that makes it easier for us to do our jobs really well. And that is just incredibly exciting. A new lighting, um, you know, that the high speed sync and all the things that are available now are just absolutely incredible tools for us to use.
Matt: [06:50] Because Gary, and here’s my question for you. Like when you started photography, were you still like lighting a match for the flash? And it was like a flash bomb,
Gary: [06:59] 30 white that far back. But a funny thing about lighting is, you know, whenever I was 19 years old and that was what, maybe 20 years ago.
Matt: [07:10] Right, right.
Gary: [07:11] Yeah. I actually bought a set of Novotron lights at the camera store in Tulsa. I financed him. It was a thousand dollars for Novotron pack and three heads and, and that was my start into lighting whenever I was 19 years old. Did you know I still use that Novotron set every single day. It’s the hair light over my main shooting area.
Matt: [07:33] That’s awesome. Yeah. Like some, like some stuff just never dies, you know what I mean? Like when it’s built well it just lasts forever.
Gary: [07:40] Yeah, I think it’s been repaired twice, but I mean it just keeps going. So. Okay, not joking about the numbers. That thing has been in use for a 35 years.
Matt: [07:50] That’s awesome. That’s a good use of your money I think. I think I broke even on that. When you’re, when you’re 19 and you spend a thousand dollars, like that’s a big deal. And so you gotTa make sure you get your money’s worth for sure. So absolutely. Um, okay. So let’s, I mean this is going fast, which is good, but let’s, let’s jump into lightning round. We can definitely take some more time. You know, lightening round implies that they’re fast answer but we can definitely take some more time. So when you were first becoming like a full time photographer, what do you think was holding you back from becoming full time photography? Or did you just kind of jump into it?
Gary: [08:23] Well that was kind of back in the stone age. Um, but you know, one of the things at that point in my life as I was still young, I was starting a young family and you know, income was it. So whenever I had opened my studio I was actually working for a camera store and I spent three days a week working in the camera store, three days a week working in the studio in five nights a week in the dark room, printing for people. So that’s how I got my start. And that helped me transition the earning gap between leaving a comfortable fulltime job and being a solely dependent upon my photography. So I was able to over the period of about nine months kind of ease my way into it. And I think that’s a big challenge for a lot of people is how do they make that change? How do they walk away from knowing they’re going to have that paycheck every two weeks to, oh my God, I hope I booked something so I make some money today. And I think that’s probably one of the greatest challenges.
Kia: [09:23] Did you always know you were wanting to be a photographer, like out of high school and that type of thing?
Gary: [09:28] Oh God, no. I changed my mind like four times while I was going to college and photography wasn’t even one of them. I ended up studying marketing and photography was a hobby. I got started in high school and I actually had thought, hey, it’d be great to work for an ad agency because I’m creative and I can do some photography and all this. And the, what happened was, um, I was working in the camera store and the studio that had been in my town for 22 years, the old guy decided to shut down and retire and it’s like, wow, okay, there’s opportunity staring me in the face. So it was perceived as I bought out his studio, but I really didn’t. He shut down and moved out and I basically went in and leased the space the next day and took over his space. So that story. Yeah, the perception was that I bought out, it was a, it was, his name was ray sledge, sledge hammer. And um, he had was, he was retiring and getting out and that’s how I got my start is I just jumped in and took over this space and started. In fact, the funny thing is initially people would come in and they would sometimes write me a check and make it out to sledge photography. That’s where they had used to be going and yeah. And the bank always took the bank, took them no big deal.
Kia: [10:50] Okay. So if you had a thousand dollars right now, what would you buy? That’s photo related.
Gary: [10:57] Oh, that’s Kinda hard for me because I’m one of those people that whenever I see something I just run out and buy it without delay. So, which is why I have so much equipment. So
Kia: [11:08] let me, let me word it this way. Like if you were giving advice to somebody new in photography and they, they had a thousand dollars, what would you tell? Where would you tell them to put their money?
Gary: [11:17] I think I would tell them to go with education, a really good comprehensive education plan a. and I don’t know if that’s the answer you’re looking for. If you’re looking for just a piece of gear education is it, you know, and take a comprehensive education, you know, sign up for a Texas school class or you know, one of my in studio workshops or something. When you go to short programs, you get little bits and pieces, but when you go to a comprehensive program like like a Texas school class, whether it’s mine or one of the other 42 amazing instructors there, you’re going to find that you’re going to get all these little pieces, but you’re also going to get how these pieces work together and that’s really essential because if you take a piece from me, a piece from you, a piece from Kaya, you know, they might not all fit together and Mesh perfectly well, so you know, how I sell albums is directly related to how I shoot for albums and that’s the importance of a comprehensive education from. From a great instructor.
Matt: [12:17] Yeah, because sometimes it’s about. It’s about the nuances, right? Like, like you said, like I’m able to do albums this way because of all these things behind the scenes.
Gary: [12:26] Absolutely. All those pieces have to work together like a puzzle.
Kia: [12:29] And so the Texas school you’re referring to is the professional photographers of America as a school in Texas. That’s a week long and so the instructors there are really there to teach something that the whole gamut of whatever their subject is, so you learn a lot and that type of a situation or in a workshop and someone studio,
Gary: [12:51] you really do. Texas school is the Texas School of professional photography. It is by far the largest affiliated PPA school and you can find them at Texas school dot Org online. They just opened registration that’s coming up the end of March, beginning of April. And you’ll find classes. They’re from, you know, pure artistic, how you do painting in Photoshop to pure business to uh, and my, my particular program encompasses a full range. I talk about marketing and pricing and sales. I talk about photography, lighting and posing backgrounds and locations. I talk about efficient workflow so you can get it done and get home to your families faster.
Kia: [13:38] Yeah, that’s great.
Matt: [13:39] Yeah. And it’s cool to like Texas schools format is so long because it’s not like you get, you know, we’re going to give Gary 30 minutes on stage to tell to tell you about his whole business in 30 years career, you know, and then you’re done. Like you actually get time to like sit with people and really work with them, which is awesome.
Gary: [13:56] That’s right. It’s like reading the complete novel instead of the cliff notes.
Matt: [13:59] Yeah.
Kia: [13:59] Perfect. Yes. Okay. So you’ve got a thousand dollars. Number one you would buy, you would do some sort of comprehensive education if you weren’t doing education. Like what’s, what’s the piece of equipment that you think is like the best new thing out there that’s really like you’re excited about whether you have it or whether, whether you would want to buy it.
Gary: [14:18] Well one of the things I’ve been fired up about the past couple of years is the. I’m a big fan of the [inaudible] sliding. They have brought really high performance lighting down to an incredibly affordable price and it just does an amazing job. And so, you know, that’s one of the places that I tell people there’s a lot of people that are so weak on lighting and so light investing in that lighting and learning the difference, getting out of that, I’m a natural light photographer, a mode because you don’t understand lighting, you know, learn and let it separate you from the masses of people out there with just point and shoot cameras.
Kia: [14:57] Well, I think natural light. What’s funny about natural light photography is when I started doing natural light photography, most people only did flash and they didn’t, couldn’t really even see the light. And so I really think if you have, like you said, both sides of it, you know, both understanding how to work a flash, how to create the light that you want and how to see it and get it, then you’re going to be a fully rounded photographer too.
Gary: [15:23] Absolutely. I, you know, I pride myself on being able to lie down, handle pretty much anything that throws my way to studio lighting, lighting up a whole cathedral. I have lit up football stadiums that night. Just can you throw at me, you know, I can handle it
Kia: [15:39] with your personality alone, right?
Gary: [15:43] Maybe
Matt: [15:44] that’s awesome. Okay. So here’s the next question. So if you got to. So if you’ve got a thousand dollars, what is the one thing that you wouldn’t spend it on in the industry? Like, you know, it doesn’t have to be a particular thing, but I mean, what’d you not, you know, by a 19th lens or would you or what? What’d you do? You know,
Gary: [16:03] you know, I wouldn’t spend it on actions and presets and things like that. I think that that’s a huge weakness and people use it as a crutch and you know, if you, uh, if you learn to develop your own...
